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Thought this might be of interest - most of the posters are coppers 
=================
Hi,
My case is now NFA'd so I think this is a legitimate post - if not I apologise.
I was arrested for rape. The accusation was malicious and unfounded. I have been told it is now NFA'd.
What are the implications for my PNC record? Would this information (that I had been arrested) be shared with the US Embassy / US Goverment / US Immigation Authorities?
How I can I get my record back to 'clean'? I have committed no crime.
What about Enhanced CRB?
Thx
Felix
=================
PNC would only record a conviction.
NFA = no conviction.
=================
PNC doesn't only record convictions. It records cases that have been dropped. Once you have been arrested, an Arrest/Summons number is generated, which is linked to PNC. Once you have been disposed of a disposal report needs to go to PNC so that the PNC record can be closed.
In your case the arrest for rape will be on your PNC record, but it would clearly show that there was no further action by the Police and no court appearance. This can potentially be shown on an enhanced CRB, it depends which boxes your potential employer ticks. I wouldn't be able to comment on the embassy bit, I don't know what information they can receive, I presume you're looking to move to the States?
With respect to getting your record back to clean - your record will show that you were arrested and that no further action was taken.
As I understand it you're not eligible for the US visa waiver programme if you've ever been arrested, even if no action was taken. The best bet is to check with them however.
=================
This means that, although I am completely innocent, the woman's allegation has made for me access to the USA and Canada more time consuming and expensive, and placed an irrevocable slur on my ECRB. Is this fair and just?
For the record, I would have been perfectly willing to answer questions voluntarily if the police had asked me, and to yield up 'evidence' as requested. I have no form at all. Why was it necessary to arrest me? Is this standard practice? Please can you give me chapter and verse to justify this?
It is the existence of arrest on my record that causes all the problems....
=================
No good coming on here and getting snotty
You asked a question and people replied giving their opinion as they understood things
I don’t think any one is going to give you chapter and verse as you seem to demand because we were not involved don’t know who you are and don’t know if this is a ongoing or closed case.
regard to pnc checks, CRB and visas speak to those who deal in such issues or seek some legal advice that way you will get a definitive answer, rather than opinions
A solicitor can provide chapter and verse at a very reasonable price
=================
Please forgive me. I have no intention of appearing snotty, I am truly sorry. I don't mean to criticise anyone. The case is closed else I would not be asking - I mean it is NFA'd.
My question relates to the issue of arrest.
I accept that I have to go to solicitor or other expert regarding CRB and Visas.
Forgive me if I seem short, but I have had a hell of a 5 months when I did nothing wrong and was arrested for rape when I would, had I been asked, have attended the police station on a voluntary basis. I did attend the police station, because I was asked to by a PC, and because I have never been in trouble and had no reason not to cooperate fully. When I got there, I was arrested.
My question relates to the need for, and proportionality of, the arrest. It has made things very difficult in a number of areas in the past five months, and I now think the DC involved recognises that i am innocent.
The problem is I have the arrest on the books which is effectively a slur given ECRB and visa applications.
So I am innocent, but have this ongoing problem as a consequence of being arrested. If there was good reason for the arrest - ie it was standard operating procedure given the nature of the case, or it gave the police greater ability to gather evidence or whatever, then I would fully understand. But it seems, without understanding things from the Police's perspective, from my perspective, that arrest may have been unnecessary and now causes problems which could have been avoided by inviting in to the station with a solicitor on a voluntary basis.
Can anyone help me as to whether arrest was appropriate and inevitable given the nature of the allegation?
I recognise that you can't give a definitive view without my revealing details, and I am not intending to make a complaint - merely to go the area commander and ask for this to be no crimed and to consider removing the arrest record from the PNC.
Thank you very much for understanding how stressful this is.....
=================
To answer your question "NO". There are too many variables to say if the arrest was justified. There have been cases when a suspect has attended the station and been arrested which have been deemed unlawful HOWEVER I believe these were for minor offences not rape. Arrest also gives powers of search (property and person), identity parades and sample collections etc.
Whilst it's **** for you imagine if your mother, sister or daughter reported a rape to the police and they didn't arrest the alleged offender? YOU say you didn't do it SHE says you did. OUR job is to gather evidence nothing more.
If your adamant about your innocence take her to court.
=================
Thank you for this. How would I go about taking her to court? And how would that benefit me in terms of the impact it would have on my record of being arrested which is the problem practically.
=================
You were arrested because you were suspected of raping someone. 9/10 times, this means that a female who probably didn't appear completely nuts at the time, went to the police and said you raped her. Was there any other evidence? No idea. But if you were NFA'd then the girl probably was nuts and there wasn't any other evidence.
Can the police arrest someone following a baseless accusation of a criminal offence? Basically, yes. Should they really be allowed to? I don't think so, but, that's life and, for what it's worth, you have my sympathy.
US immigration will absolutely not be interested in a simple arrest/NFA, nor will they check.
Your options for proceeding against the female alligationist/alligator are limited and/or expensive. The police probably won't proceed so you could try making a complaint against the police (cheap but unlikely to succeed) or going through the civil courts for damages (expensive and unlikely to succeed), either way, a solicitor will be a huge help, fill you with confidence and ultimately take all your money.
Finally, and off-topic, what is it with British girls and rape allegations? When I was in the UK, we used to get one a week and since I moved across the pond, I have had one every 18 months.
=================
Once again this is not a free legal drop in. However if you wish to claim for any losses you feel you have suffered contact a Solicitor. there are plenty who will work on a No Winn No Fee basis. If they take the case on there is a fair chance you will win something. You will have to show what you have lost and what possible financial costs you can expect to pay in the future. It may be nothing on the other hand it could be a considerable amount. You know your circumstances. Go and contact a Solicitor. Don’t leave it too long.
If you think you were dealt with incorrectly, make a complaint to the Professional Standards Department of the police force that dealt with you or the IPCC (though if you do go to the IPCC, it will still get passed to the Professional Standards Dept of the force anyway). Don't ask questions of the legality of the arrest on here as my colleagues have mentioned, they won't be able to comment as they don't know the full story nor want to.
=================
What the officers say here is generally sound BUT If you volunteered to attend for interview and were then arrested when you turned up, you may well have a case against the police for false arrest.
Read up on case [2011] EWHC 773 (Q
Torts-other-police. This case is a landmark and will serve to cut out much of the nonsense that has been going on regarding the willy-nilly arresting of people.
If you gave evidence to police that pointed away from offending and this was not followed up then the officers concerned are in breach of CPIA 1996 as investigation work obliges police to pursue ALL reasonable lines. That would form part of the complaint you may choose to make. In the first instance, I would address this to the force's own professional standards department and then, if necessary, to the IPCC.
I agree with the officers here that you definitely need competent advice to guide you as regards any action you undertake. Everything will turn on the unique facts of your case and what I say is of purely general interest.
=================
How is it false arrest? If there is reasonable suspicion a crime has been committed...then the power exists. Asking someone to attend for arrest by appointment is easier then trying to chase them around.
=================
In the first instance, I would address this to the force's own professional standards department and then, if necessary, to the IPCC.
Please read the role of the IPCC. They do not investigate complaints per se with the exception of serious matters. They supervise and manage certain investigations which are carried out by Professional Standards departments.
If you make a complaint to a Professional Standards Dept they will deal with it. If it is made to the IPCC, one of the bits of the form is that you consent for the matter to be passed to the respective PSD to deal with the matter. If you don't consent to this, the matter will not be dealt with. So by making a complaint to the IPCC, they will pass it onto the PSD to deal with.
Most results of complaints finish with a right of appeal to the IPCC if the complainant is not satisfied with the way the matter was dealt with. This is after the matter has been investigated.
=================
"How is it false arrest? If there is reasonable suspicion a crime has been committed...then the power exists. Asking someone to attend for arrest by appointment is eaiser then trying to chase them around."
Yes the power exists but it is qualified under SOCAP in that the arrest has to be necessary.
Here's a summary of the case in question:
http://www.5essexcou...011-ewhc-773-qb
=================
Cheers for the link. Makes sense.
In this scenario, I suppose arrest is necessary to obtain DNA or other forensic potential, hence prompt and effective.
In this scenario, I suppose arrest is necessary to obtain DNA or other forensic potential, hence prompt and effective.
=================
Not necessarily. The OP offered to attend by agreement which by definition supports rather than militates against, a prompt and effective investigation. It seems apparent that the lessons of this case have not yet filtered through.
Like I said, everything will turn on the OP's unique facts. The case strongly underlines that arrest must be properly justified - like the PACE rules say - and that catch-all's like 'prompt and effective' can no longer be relied upon as a backstop.
=================
{snip}
Nothing in what I say should suggest to you that your arrest was not justified though. The police rightly have a relatively free hand to deal with crime, particularly of the kind you were unfairly accused of and it is therefore not easy to make a complaint stick.
=================
Hi,
My case is now NFA'd so I think this is a legitimate post - if not I apologise.
I was arrested for rape. The accusation was malicious and unfounded. I have been told it is now NFA'd.
What are the implications for my PNC record? Would this information (that I had been arrested) be shared with the US Embassy / US Goverment / US Immigation Authorities?
How I can I get my record back to 'clean'? I have committed no crime.
What about Enhanced CRB?
Thx
Felix
=================
PNC would only record a conviction.
NFA = no conviction.
=================
PNC doesn't only record convictions. It records cases that have been dropped. Once you have been arrested, an Arrest/Summons number is generated, which is linked to PNC. Once you have been disposed of a disposal report needs to go to PNC so that the PNC record can be closed.
In your case the arrest for rape will be on your PNC record, but it would clearly show that there was no further action by the Police and no court appearance. This can potentially be shown on an enhanced CRB, it depends which boxes your potential employer ticks. I wouldn't be able to comment on the embassy bit, I don't know what information they can receive, I presume you're looking to move to the States?
With respect to getting your record back to clean - your record will show that you were arrested and that no further action was taken.
As I understand it you're not eligible for the US visa waiver programme if you've ever been arrested, even if no action was taken. The best bet is to check with them however.
=================
This means that, although I am completely innocent, the woman's allegation has made for me access to the USA and Canada more time consuming and expensive, and placed an irrevocable slur on my ECRB. Is this fair and just?
For the record, I would have been perfectly willing to answer questions voluntarily if the police had asked me, and to yield up 'evidence' as requested. I have no form at all. Why was it necessary to arrest me? Is this standard practice? Please can you give me chapter and verse to justify this?
It is the existence of arrest on my record that causes all the problems....
=================
No good coming on here and getting snotty
You asked a question and people replied giving their opinion as they understood things
I don’t think any one is going to give you chapter and verse as you seem to demand because we were not involved don’t know who you are and don’t know if this is a ongoing or closed case.
regard to pnc checks, CRB and visas speak to those who deal in such issues or seek some legal advice that way you will get a definitive answer, rather than opinions
A solicitor can provide chapter and verse at a very reasonable price
=================
Please forgive me. I have no intention of appearing snotty, I am truly sorry. I don't mean to criticise anyone. The case is closed else I would not be asking - I mean it is NFA'd.
My question relates to the issue of arrest.
I accept that I have to go to solicitor or other expert regarding CRB and Visas.
Forgive me if I seem short, but I have had a hell of a 5 months when I did nothing wrong and was arrested for rape when I would, had I been asked, have attended the police station on a voluntary basis. I did attend the police station, because I was asked to by a PC, and because I have never been in trouble and had no reason not to cooperate fully. When I got there, I was arrested.
My question relates to the need for, and proportionality of, the arrest. It has made things very difficult in a number of areas in the past five months, and I now think the DC involved recognises that i am innocent.
The problem is I have the arrest on the books which is effectively a slur given ECRB and visa applications.
So I am innocent, but have this ongoing problem as a consequence of being arrested. If there was good reason for the arrest - ie it was standard operating procedure given the nature of the case, or it gave the police greater ability to gather evidence or whatever, then I would fully understand. But it seems, without understanding things from the Police's perspective, from my perspective, that arrest may have been unnecessary and now causes problems which could have been avoided by inviting in to the station with a solicitor on a voluntary basis.
Can anyone help me as to whether arrest was appropriate and inevitable given the nature of the allegation?
I recognise that you can't give a definitive view without my revealing details, and I am not intending to make a complaint - merely to go the area commander and ask for this to be no crimed and to consider removing the arrest record from the PNC.
Thank you very much for understanding how stressful this is.....
=================
To answer your question "NO". There are too many variables to say if the arrest was justified. There have been cases when a suspect has attended the station and been arrested which have been deemed unlawful HOWEVER I believe these were for minor offences not rape. Arrest also gives powers of search (property and person), identity parades and sample collections etc.
Whilst it's **** for you imagine if your mother, sister or daughter reported a rape to the police and they didn't arrest the alleged offender? YOU say you didn't do it SHE says you did. OUR job is to gather evidence nothing more.
If your adamant about your innocence take her to court.
=================
Thank you for this. How would I go about taking her to court? And how would that benefit me in terms of the impact it would have on my record of being arrested which is the problem practically.
=================
You were arrested because you were suspected of raping someone. 9/10 times, this means that a female who probably didn't appear completely nuts at the time, went to the police and said you raped her. Was there any other evidence? No idea. But if you were NFA'd then the girl probably was nuts and there wasn't any other evidence.
Can the police arrest someone following a baseless accusation of a criminal offence? Basically, yes. Should they really be allowed to? I don't think so, but, that's life and, for what it's worth, you have my sympathy.
US immigration will absolutely not be interested in a simple arrest/NFA, nor will they check.
Your options for proceeding against the female alligationist/alligator are limited and/or expensive. The police probably won't proceed so you could try making a complaint against the police (cheap but unlikely to succeed) or going through the civil courts for damages (expensive and unlikely to succeed), either way, a solicitor will be a huge help, fill you with confidence and ultimately take all your money.
Finally, and off-topic, what is it with British girls and rape allegations? When I was in the UK, we used to get one a week and since I moved across the pond, I have had one every 18 months.
=================
Once again this is not a free legal drop in. However if you wish to claim for any losses you feel you have suffered contact a Solicitor. there are plenty who will work on a No Winn No Fee basis. If they take the case on there is a fair chance you will win something. You will have to show what you have lost and what possible financial costs you can expect to pay in the future. It may be nothing on the other hand it could be a considerable amount. You know your circumstances. Go and contact a Solicitor. Don’t leave it too long.
If you think you were dealt with incorrectly, make a complaint to the Professional Standards Department of the police force that dealt with you or the IPCC (though if you do go to the IPCC, it will still get passed to the Professional Standards Dept of the force anyway). Don't ask questions of the legality of the arrest on here as my colleagues have mentioned, they won't be able to comment as they don't know the full story nor want to.
=================
What the officers say here is generally sound BUT If you volunteered to attend for interview and were then arrested when you turned up, you may well have a case against the police for false arrest.
Read up on case [2011] EWHC 773 (Q
Torts-other-police. This case is a landmark and will serve to cut out much of the nonsense that has been going on regarding the willy-nilly arresting of people. If you gave evidence to police that pointed away from offending and this was not followed up then the officers concerned are in breach of CPIA 1996 as investigation work obliges police to pursue ALL reasonable lines. That would form part of the complaint you may choose to make. In the first instance, I would address this to the force's own professional standards department and then, if necessary, to the IPCC.
I agree with the officers here that you definitely need competent advice to guide you as regards any action you undertake. Everything will turn on the unique facts of your case and what I say is of purely general interest.
=================
How is it false arrest? If there is reasonable suspicion a crime has been committed...then the power exists. Asking someone to attend for arrest by appointment is easier then trying to chase them around.
=================
In the first instance, I would address this to the force's own professional standards department and then, if necessary, to the IPCC.
Please read the role of the IPCC. They do not investigate complaints per se with the exception of serious matters. They supervise and manage certain investigations which are carried out by Professional Standards departments.
If you make a complaint to a Professional Standards Dept they will deal with it. If it is made to the IPCC, one of the bits of the form is that you consent for the matter to be passed to the respective PSD to deal with the matter. If you don't consent to this, the matter will not be dealt with. So by making a complaint to the IPCC, they will pass it onto the PSD to deal with.
Most results of complaints finish with a right of appeal to the IPCC if the complainant is not satisfied with the way the matter was dealt with. This is after the matter has been investigated.
=================
"How is it false arrest? If there is reasonable suspicion a crime has been committed...then the power exists. Asking someone to attend for arrest by appointment is eaiser then trying to chase them around."
Yes the power exists but it is qualified under SOCAP in that the arrest has to be necessary.
Here's a summary of the case in question:
http://www.5essexcou...011-ewhc-773-qb
=================
Cheers for the link. Makes sense.
In this scenario, I suppose arrest is necessary to obtain DNA or other forensic potential, hence prompt and effective.
In this scenario, I suppose arrest is necessary to obtain DNA or other forensic potential, hence prompt and effective.
=================
Not necessarily. The OP offered to attend by agreement which by definition supports rather than militates against, a prompt and effective investigation. It seems apparent that the lessons of this case have not yet filtered through.
Like I said, everything will turn on the OP's unique facts. The case strongly underlines that arrest must be properly justified - like the PACE rules say - and that catch-all's like 'prompt and effective' can no longer be relied upon as a backstop.
=================
{snip}
Nothing in what I say should suggest to you that your arrest was not justified though. The police rightly have a relatively free hand to deal with crime, particularly of the kind you were unfairly accused of and it is therefore not easy to make a complaint stick.