Confused after report of rape

[Faith]

We do have a number of Scottish members on here who have been arrested/charged without any evidence.

I think you have been treated very badly. It is by no means a given that those accused of rape will not be arrested without 100% proof

[worriedandconcerned]

I happen to agree that that SHOULD remain the case...after all...how can one prove that they have been raped?

I hope you are doing well.

I like most on here will think merlinscott has been treated terrible BUT in her case as well as the falsely accused the key is a proper investigation both ways done in an impartial way but we all know this does not happen on both sides.
The trouble is it is just as bad to be falsely accused as it is to be raped so in my opinion the key to this is a proper investigation and for this we need a more balanced view from the police from both sides.

[MerlinScot]

I like most on here will think merlinscott has been treated terrible BUT in her case as well as the falsely accused the key is a proper investigation both ways done in an impartial way but we all know this does not happen on both sides.
The trouble is it is just as bad to be falsely accused as it is to be raped so in my opinion the key to this is a proper investigation and for this we need a more balanced view from the police from both sides.

I totally agree. Mistakes come from bad investigations on both sides!! So the TERRIBLE treatment is reserved to both raped women/men and those who're unfairly paying without having committed any crime at all.

@RFHL: This is not the right time to write to the local MP, because we're having the elections in 4 days. Maybe later.

@FAITH: I've to disagree on that point, unless the accusers had very good lawyers. The Scottish Law states that you've to show 2 proofs of evidence out of 3, one of each has to be physical or providing an incredible certainty the crime has been committed. My rapes were historical and during a relationship, so to provide certain evidence was impossible. Well, the few proofs I had weren't admitted either though!!

So that's why false allegations of rape are very rare up here. I'm not saying this lightly, I can give you the statistics of any rape and abuse organizations. Accusers lies are usually discovered a lot more and earlier than in England, most of the liars recant under pressure, the police threats you as a terrorist at the first suspiscion (in my case was a Facebook message!! Well, needless to say, my proofs to support me weren't admitted, who knows why!!).
Fooling the Scottish Law isn't easy, usually it damages a lot more the rape victims than the innocent ones, this due to the one special law. Have a look at this link, it explains this better a lot than me!! http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/c...cases.17174035 To be honest, I even tried to post on that site and my comment wasn't ever authorized. You'd be shocked to see how few rape cases end up on a paper or online and all the false accusers end up in the cover of any paper. Again, here it's different, many villages are concerned about innocent men accused and so many raped women...won't ever see any justice. Like me, that the only solution possible became leaving where I was living and moving far away. The slander done behind my back is now irreparable, so yes it's awful to see me considered as a liar after being in a domestic abuse and rape case and my ex is now let free of abusing someone else. Would like to see the reaction of the parents of the children who are totally unaware their sons and daughters are around an abuser and a rapist all day.

[RFLH]

I may be wrong, but the way I've read it is that 'a bloke' has to rape at least 2 women before they will be satisfied he's guilty?

[Izzy]

I may be wrong, but the way I've read it is that 'a bloke' has to rape at least 2 women before they will be satisfied he's guilty?

You've read it wrong

The Cadder judgement is evidence gained by police whilst a suspect didn't have access to a lawyer breached human rights.

[RFLH]

that'll teach me to read it through twice!!

[RFLH]

that'll teach me to read it through twice!!

[MerlinScot]

Well the Cadder judgement damages rape victims a lot, because most of the time suspects have the time to destroy all the proofs that could provide evidence to prosecute him (especially in cases where computers, mobile phones and laptops contain lots of evidence).

Despite it's quite correct to respect the accused's rights too (he/she could be innocent), in a rape case it's always the victim's word against the accused's one, so that law keeps a staggering percentage of rapists out of jail.

[Izzy]

The Cadder ruling was that a suspect could be held for up to six hours without access to a solicitor. Although suspects had a right to silence during interview, anything they did say could be used as evidence against them in subsequent court proceedings.

In its judgment in the case of Cadder v HMA, published on 26 October 2010, the Supreme Court decided this practice was contrary to the European Convention on Human Rights. Under the Scotland Act 1998, and the Human Rights Act 1998. Both the law of Scotland and the United Kingdom must comply with the Convention

Any mobiles/computer etc would be seized if needed for evidence so the Cadder ruling would have no effect on this.

You said a report had been sent to the PF, so maybe there will be a case to be heard?
If you're not happy with the police, have you thought about making a complaint?

[MerlinScot]

The Cadder ruling was that a suspect could be held for up to six hours without access to a solicitor. Although suspects had a right to silence during interview, anything they did say could be used as evidence against them in subsequent court proceedings.

In its judgment in the case of Cadder v HMA, published on 26 October 2010, the Supreme Court decided this practice was contrary to the European Convention on Human Rights. Under the Scotland Act 1998, and the Human Rights Act 1998. Both the law of Scotland and the United Kingdom must comply with the Convention

Any mobiles/computer etc would be seized if needed for evidence so the Cadder ruling would have no effect on this.

You said a report had been sent to the PF, so maybe there will be a case to be heard?
If you're not happy with the police, have you thought about making a complaint?

Izzy, I know that very well because I was detained for two hours without a solicitor. And like you said in your post, I could have stayed silent but started crying as a baby soon after. I've never been even fined in my life, let alone being detained. They asked me if I wanted to drop the charges and I said no, that I even want to add something to my statement. They seemed pissed, like "so you want to waste more of our time???".

I was offered a lawyer, they're forced to ask, but given that from the second meeting the DC had already told me that prosecuting my ex was difficult because I was in a relationship with the accused at the time of the rapes, I had never got for a solicitor before knowing if my case was going to court.

About the PF, that's unclear. In the letter the PF said that police asked him for advice but only filed a report later, accusing... nobody. They suggest I should be prosecuted for false allegations but the PF hadn't decided yet. In his letter said that he was trying to be respecteful of my rights but the evidence was a lot. I made him notice that police had blocked me from giving more though.

Yeah I thought to complain although I've no idea where to start!! ;( I'm so tired, maybe they should tell rape victims that in case the police is sexist you can be prosecuted and jailed after a rape report. I came forward after two months of therapy and only because rape and abuse organizations convinced me it was the right thing to do, given the accused's job.
Honestly, this came out as an abuse over the long abuse I had already received.

P.S: my computer wasn't ever seized and my ex's neither, so I guess they were lazy policemen?

[lawlessone2009]

I feel for you.

What you may discover is that the Police are busy working away in the background. They ALWAYS put pressure on the accuser to ensure that their efforts are going to be worth while. It may seem as if they don't believe you and they may threaten jail or whatever BUT I can assure you that this will not happen and they take all statements/accusations at face value and act according to what they interpret.

If your ex-boyfriend has acted in an abusive sexual manner before and this has been reported then it will be on file. The Police along with the Crown Prosecution Service will trail through all previous allegations and use 'The Moorov Doctrine' to bring about corroborative evidence.

If there is no previous allegations on file and you are the first to report then they most likely will not proceed. However, given what you have stated has happened to you over an extended period of time I would sleep well at night knowing that you WILL be listened too in the future. I would however worry about how long your ex will be able to abuse a future partner for before she goes to the Police, I would hope it is a short time!

Once this happens you will be brought back into the frame within a few short months of the reporting and preparations will be made for you to be a key prosecution witness against your ex.

It may seem as if YOU are being made out to be wrong at the moment or that you are lying but due to the very serious nature of a rape allegation the Police must apply pressure to everyone involved in the hope that either someone cracks OR the accused slips up. It is rare for the accuser to get their story wrong but very easy for the accused to make a fatal mistake. If the accuser is lying then they, also, can make mistakes. It's a massive case for the Police to investigate and could entail several departments/regions along with legal advisors and a specially trained prosecuting team. Being in the highlands may mean it takes longer and far more effort so they are merely applying pressure on you to ensure you are not lying.

It could also be a case that they understand your ex's experience in the field and his undoubted knowledge of how to squirm out of things. They could be cutting him some slack rope just now so that he relaxes enough to wrap it round his neck later on when he thinks he's gotten away with it.

[MerlinScot]

I feel for you.

What you may discover is that the Police are busy working away in the background. They ALWAYS put pressure on the accuser to ensure that their efforts are going to be worth while. It may seem as if they don't believe you and they may threaten jail or whatever BUT I can assure you that this will not happen and they take all statements/accusations at face value and act according to what they interpret.

If your ex-boyfriend has acted in an abusive sexual manner before and this has been reported then it will be on file. The Police along with the Crown Prosecution Service will trail through all previous allegations and use 'The Moorov Doctrine' to bring about corroborative evidence.

If there is no previous allegations on file and you are the first to report then they most likely will not proceed. However, given what you have stated has happened to you over an extended period of time I would sleep well at night knowing that you WILL be listened too in the future. I would however worry about how long your ex will be able to abuse a future partner for before she goes to the Police, I would hope it is a short time!

Once this happens you will be brought back into the frame within a few short months of the reporting and preparations will be made for you to be a key prosecution witness against your ex.

It may seem as if YOU are being made out to be wrong at the moment or that you are lying but due to the very serious nature of a rape allegation the Police must apply pressure to everyone involved in the hope that either someone cracks OR the accused slips up. It is rare for the accuser to get their story wrong but very easy for the accused to make a fatal mistake. If the accuser is lying then they, also, can make mistakes. It's a massive case for the Police to investigate and could entail several departments/regions along with legal advisors and a specially trained prosecuting team. Being in the highlands may mean it takes longer and far more effort so they are merely applying pressure on you to ensure you are not lying.

It could also be a case that they understand your ex's experience in the field and his undoubted knowledge of how to squirm out of things. They could be cutting him some slack rope just now so that he relaxes enough to wrap it round his neck later on when he thinks he's gotten away with it.

Following what said by the DC (and later on by the PF in his letter of about 10 days ago) at the time of my detention, which happened on February 25th, the charges were dropped 2 days earlier (February 23rd) and they weren't going to do any further investigation. So the case against the accused was closed more than 2 months ago. Which was a source of complaint for me because I stated that I was the victim and they should let me know what was going on. I had a reply from the PF only recently. No, they put all the pressure on me intentionally.
Hey, they're really into witch hunt here, I gathered few comments online and they all say the same thing. Fact is that after you report someone, and they don't listen to you... what do you do? I mean, I'm fighting to defend myself, I spend lots of time to gather information that can convince them I'm not lying, looking for hours into correspondence of various nature if something can prove that.
I'm on a verge of a nervous breakdown only because I reported a rapist after having got a depression after the rapes and the abuse themselves!
Honestly, I'm still wondering why they all say you should report it... What for??

My ex had allegations and drinking charges in Lincolnshire. He also had a personal psychiatrist in England since he was 8 plus psychiatric assistance up here. He has a manic depression bordering on schizophrenia. Having said that, he's far from stupid. Someone who tries to become a counsellor to get to vulnerable women in an easier way, he shows he has quite an evil mind. This has been understood by everybody except the police. They bought the "nice family, nice guy" tale.

My ex was questioned at home and 2 weeks later detained at the police station, released one hour later and 2 days later he was informed the charges were dropped (the DC informed me about it. I never had any contact with my ex after the 1st report).

P.S: they don't care about him at all. I informed them that he was up to his game again with a girl in Edinburgh. It fell on deaf ears. He said he had been like that with previous girlfriends too, but clearly they had avoided to report. I couldn't track them down because they both live in south England, nor it was my duty either though, that should be police's task!

[lawlessone2009]

I've spent the time reading your 'Letter to JL'. I see in you a very strong and capable woman. I would however be careful at the moment to ensure that what has happened to you at the hands of the 'justice' system does not have a lasting effect.

As I stated, Mr Moorov will eventually catch up with your ex. The line of accusations eventually mount up. If I was you I would be proud of what you have achieved so far and disregard how others have treated you so disgracefully.

There most likely will come a time when your ill will towards the justice system will need to be swept to the side and you will require to become a believer again. You will no doubt have your day in court and see your ex receive the sentence that he appears to deserve.

I can only really really hope that somebody else doesn't need to suffer in the terrible manner that you have. I can only hope that he meets his maker sooner rather than later and that when he does a proper Police Officer takes charge and ensures that justice is served.

I am not entirely certain that I would encourage you to pursue matters further as they stand at the moment. If you keep sticking your head up eventually someone will blow it off. You have done as much as 'the system' with all their stupid rules and regulations allows, just now. Better keeping your head down and focusing on your own future.

I would however actively encourage you to continue writing. I appreciate your letter and enjoy the way you have put the words/sentences/paragraphs together. Your letter has soul and meaning. I would also hazard a guess that it helps you exert some of your negative energies into what I see as a very positive piece of writing. Your 'letter' may well encourage many more women to realise the situation they are in and make moves to change things for their benefit.

It only takes one person to spread a message and I reckon you are more than capable. You can engage the reader and lead them to a logical conclusion. Write more and dwell less.

[Faith]

If there is no previous allegations on file and you are the first to report then they most likely will not proceed.

Urmmm...are you sure about that? Were there previous allegations against you?

MerlinScot I may have missed something (very likely, I sometimes skim!!) but why were you detained?

[lawlessone2009]

I do have a previous allegation, I've mentioned it and also mentioned my now falling foul to the Moorov doctrine.

Both allegations have been made for completely different reasons. First one is a long and hard one to explain but basically falls back to jealousy. I'm still working on the reason for the second oneeee.................................

If an allegation is made and there is not enough evidence to proceed then although it is dropped it remains on file. If a further allegation is made, from someone else (possibly even the same person in certain circumstances I believe), then this is placed alongside the original allegation and the Moorov Doctrine is then implemented to see if the two allegations, being seperate, do have relative relationships to each other and can provide corroboration for each other.

The previous allegation I had made against me involved kissing someone. I didn't kiss them, the Police believed me and the case was rightly brought to a halt and thrown to the wind. It's now resurfacing as attempted rape! I cannot shout it out enough, people really really need to be careful or they will suffer far greater consequences later on.

Now that I've clarified my position I am sure that Merlin may take onboard that an allegation made just now can be used to corroborate an allegation made later on. The very fact you've reported it is good. If your ex is the way you make him out then he WILL re-offend.

I would encourage you to read my own post if you have any doubts about me or what I am stating. I'm currently being slaughtered for two allegations that don't even make sense and I am sure the prosecution must also be scratching their heads and wondering what the hell is going on. I can only wait like everyone else... You're case is massively different to my own and far more complex which is why I don't understand why you are not being believed. Lies are easy to tell when they involve simple acts but long term abuse is on a completely different planet.

You will see justice served in the end.