Refusing to sign bail

[IRB777]

Hi i have been on pre-charge bail now for 20 months falsely accused by my ex-partner. My defense case should i need it would be very strong. What i want to know is has anybody any experience of refusing to sign bail, so that the custody clock runs out and the CPS are then forced to make a decision ? My case is mental health related and has no evidence whatsoever but a huge amount that suggests its malicious. My solicitor says there are 6 hours left on it and getting a superintendant to add another 24 hrs after 20 months wouldnt happen. My solicitor advises this should be our next step.

[Casehardened]

I can't recall where I saw the link but this was mentioned elsewhere recently and I think the answer was that even if you didn't sign the sheet you would be bailed regardless and have to adhere to the bail conditions.

[Kjg]

I found this but not sure if correct but there is a bail act

Yes the suspect can refuse to sign the Bail Notice. But that is what it is, a notice. If the person does not surrender bail on the date specified in the notice they will be arrested and charged with a bail act offence. If they do not adhere to bail conditions, they will be arrested and released, unless they are charged with the original offence.

[IRB777]

i found this but not sure if correct but there is a bail act

yes the suspect can refuse to sign the bail notice. But that is what it is, a notice. If the person does not surrender bail on the date specified in the notice they will be arrested and charged with a bail act offence. If they do not adhere to bail conditions, they will be arrested and released, unless they are charged with the original offence.

thats really interesting. Im really confused now ,why would a solicitor advise this if thats true ! Unless he doesnt know what hes talking about ? I think its good advice that there are some very light weight solicitors out there. Common assault bread and butter solicitors. Your probably right as i cant see such an obvious gapeing loop hole unprotected ! The legal world is not one i want to know full of people devoid of morality !

[IRB777]

iLL LET U KNOW WHAT HAPPENS NEXT WEEK WHEN I TELL THEM WHAT TO DO WITH THERE BAIL ! FIND IT HILARIOUS SOME OF MY CONDITIONS ARE NOT TO ENTER HER STREET OR THE STREETS AROUND IT. WHATS REALLY FUNNY IS SHE MOVED HOUSE 4 WEEKS AGO AND THE BAIL HASNT BEEN ALTERED SO I CANT ENTER A STREET WHERE SHE DOESNT LIVE, BUT CAN GO SIT OUTSIDE HER HOUSE AT HER NEW ADDRESS SO LONG AS IM NOT WITHIN 100YDS. FIND IT LAUGHABLE HOW **** THEY ARE AT THERE JOBS.

[IRB777]

I think a possible way round this bail issue and running the clock out could be to physically challenge bail. As in go stand in her street and ring the police and tell them what im doing. They would arrest me but then have to release me again as they cant bring charges and breach of bail is not a criminal offence. Would the custody clock run when arrested for breach ????

[Rights Fighter]

I've just asked a duty solicitor the question. The worst thing you can do is to put yourself into any further bother - hence my email to the sol. I'll post up the response once I have it.

[Rights Fighter]

The response as I thought!

The clock obviously stops running at the point the Police say you are free to leave. There is a theory that bail conditions are not enforceable if you refuse to sign for them which has more substance to it but I have never seen put to the test legally. However, I do not see him getting in to any trouble other than the Police using it as a ground to refuse bail, which I have certainly seen happen. That is the only real consequence of refusing to sign.

Please be careful!

[Rights Fighter]

I think a possible way round this bail issue and running the clock out could be to physically challenge bail. As in go stand in her street and ring the police and tell them what im doing. They would arrest me but then have to release me again as they cant bring charges and breach of bail is not a criminal offence. Would the custody clock run when arrested for breach ????

Do be careful!!


I asked the duty solicitor I have been in contact with about that too:

He needs to understand the difference between the CPS threshold and full evidence tests for charging decisions. If he refuses to abide by bail conditions, the CPS need only reasonable suspicion to charge him and remand in custody.

[Genuine]

We were advised the same

I've just asked a duty solicitor the question. The worst thing you can do is to put yourself into any further bother - hence my email to the sol. I'll post up the response once I have it.

Hi

This is an interesting post . When we had enough of our solicitor we spoke to another one who said exactly the same. However some solicitors would argue that this could have an adverse effect to what you are promised. They could potentially charge you and im sure this isnt what you want.

Im so glad we didnt go down that road.

I can honestly speak from experience when i tell you that no solicitor can hurry things along. The police are and will always work at THEIR pace and not yours (unfortunately) . In the end my partner was nfa'd , did that have anything to do with our solicitor ?? Hell no !!
The case was purely based on circumstances and incompetency from the police, nothing more

Please take my advise and let it run its course. And this is coming from the most impatient person ever known to man ....

Take care buddy

[Boys don't cry]

Hi IRB777.

20 months on bail is a long time waiting for a CPS decision,it isn't fair but at least it is not a charge.
I am not in your situation but as RF already wrote you should be careful.

The last thing you want is to go to court as the police would definitely show the judge and jury your refusal to sign.
By refusing you are ready to challenge the police,the CPS and I believe the prosecution barrister would tell the jury that you refused to follow the rules.
I am not even writing about you going in the girl's street and ringing the police which would make your case worse.

Patience is a virtue and as Casehardened once wrote to me :Keep calm and carry on!

[karmaiscoming]

My husband refused to sign on the second time he answered bail, but just because he was really angry. He actually stuck to bail conditions and did everything he was supposed to, he just didn't want to sign their paper as it said very clearly on it that he must not go home still and he was really upset with that condition.

That was more from anger and upset though, completely different to your situation I understand.

Nothing is fair, nothing goes the way we want it to, we just have to play their games, it's really as simple as that unfortunately.

[IRB777]

thanks for peoples advice, i know the risk of not being granted bail in the future, its one ive thought about alot. Ive also been in contact with social services today when i saw my daughters. Apparently the reason the police havent altered the bail is so they dont have to tell me where she now lives. But ive already been told by a friend who saw her in the street, so that will obviously change. I was denied visitation with my children for a year and a half, im just now starting to see them very intermitently. Social services today have told me they are recommending that i have regular contact from now on. This is a battle that is going my way. Im going to have a think over the weekend about my options and your advice. many thanks