Advice please needed, desperately lost and confused

[veryworriedgirlfriend]

Hi all

I have some specific questions about what I'm going through. I stumbled upon this forum which has been a real help.

My boyfriend is falsely accused of several counts of sexual assault including rape. She's claiming he raped her twice too. He did have one sexual encounter with this girl but they didn't have sex. They were touching each other, he ejaculated on his hand and then touched her. Therefore his DNA was found on/in her.

His solicitor has suggested he change his statement and claim they did have sex but it was consensual. She claims that the prosecution will call him a liar and say they must have had sex because of the DNA on/in her and it will make him look like a liar. However that means he actually has to lie and I'm wondering if that is necessary. He's so confused about what to do. Surely a court and jury will understand how DNA could have got in her that way? And also won't the tests the police do show whether they had sex? won't the fact there is very little semen prove that it wasn't sex? especially twice as she claims?

Also someone from his solicitors contacted him yesterday saying she urged him to plead guilty because he is almost definitely going to prison for this and a guilty plea would shorten his sentence considerably. She was a go between the solicitors and cps but actually worked at his solicitors.
I'm wondering if these solicitors are any good and if/how to go about changing solicitor when he is getting legal aid. Especially since when this started his solicitor said it is so ridiculous she would be amazed if got anywhere near a court room!

Any help/advice/experience people have in this is greatly appreciated.

I know he is innocent and there are lots of things in his favour, I believe he can win this, it's just really disheartening to hear the solicitors don't and I'm losing faith in our 'fair and just' system.

Thanks in advance

[Casehardened]

Hi & welcome to the forum,

Firstly well done for supporting your boyfriend through this (especially if he had this encounter whilst in the relationship with you?) as it will be a great help to him.

To help members give the correct advice can you confirm that he has already been charged with the offences; though I imagine this is so if his solicitor is discussing his plea.

Solicitors and barristers are legally obliged to inform the accused about the discount for a guilty plea, so it doesn't necessarily mean that they are convinced of their clients guilt.

However it is strongly recommended that no-one pleads guilty unless they actually did commit the offence, if he does it will be pointless maintaining his innocence later on.

[veryworriedgirlfriend]

Yes he was charged 3 weeks ago. I don't think he would ever consider pleasing guilty but the thing he is considering is whether he needs to change his statement to say they had sex. We are both honest innocent people and it seems wrong lying in court. But if it will help him fight and win this is it worth considering? We are both struggling to see how lying will help.

The incident happened a couple of months before I met him. I knew he was on bail and he could potentially be charged but over time I got to know him, trust him and love him. I wasn't then and am still not prepared to let an evil person get in the way of our happily ever after.

All of this is like stepping in to another world or being caught in a never ending nightmare. We just want to start fighting this, but he doesn't even plead until April

[Casehardened]

I've swopped the quoted sections around to suit my responses

The incident happened a couple of months before I met him. I knew he was on bail and he could potentially be charged but over time I got to know him, trust him and love him.

I'm gong to be brutally honest here and wondered if he'd not told you the full details of what actually happened in order to spare your feelings (and perhaps salvage the relationship)

Obviously as it happened prior to you getting together this is not the case, nevertheless it is important he tells the solicitor exactly what did happen in order that he can get the correct advice.


Yes he was charged 3 weeks ago. I don't think he would ever consider pleasing guilty but the thing he is considering is whether he needs to change his statement to say they had sex. We are both honest innocent people and it seems wrong lying in court. But if it will help him fight and win this is it worth considering? We are both struggling to see how lying will help.

The defence will be that the sexual activity was with consent rather than it did not take place at all; so in a sense therefore what actually happened is irrelevant except in a matter of degree (in that penalties for rape are higher than for assault) the important thing is to convince the jury (ordinary folks, not lawyers) that this encounter was consensual: e.g. if he was already in a long relationship with the girl at the time this will be a factor in his favour.

I can understand where his solicitor is coming from in him wanting to change his story but the point is that if it gets to court the prosecuting barrister will have a sixth sense as to whether the accused is telling porkies and will cross-examine until he trips him up. If it can be demonstrated to the jury that the accused is telling lies than that will be a huge factor in their decision (unless the defence can then convincingly explain as to why the accused lied)

It is always easier to remember the truth in a stressful situation so if your boyfriend's statement gives the true facts he can stand in the witness box, head held high, and answer all questioning honestly and directly.

To sum it all up, ensure that bf's statement is a true one

All of this is like stepping in to another world or being caught in a never ending nightmare.

l think that most of us know exactly what you mean

It is fairly difficult to change solicitors after charge if he is on legal aid; basically his new solicitors will have to show the LSC good reason for making the change; however urging him into a guilty plea and asking him to make a false statement sound very good reasons!

There are some recommendations from members in this thread:

http://www.daftmoo.org.uk/mooforum/s...ist-solicitors

[evian1976]

I thought if your not guilty no matter what don't plead guilty regardless!

[brokengirlfriend]

hi, i know exactly what you are going through as im in the same situation but only difference is in my bf situation there was no semen found in the condom or on or near the girl as they didn't have full sex, I think you have to stay strong and hope for the best my bfs court case is next week after 13 months of being on bail with the limited evidence, i think its wrong that they prosecute poor innocent men when there is little evidence and it is blatantly obvious the woman is lying for attention.

[veryworriedgirlfriend]

Thanks for the advice, it's good to hear advice that telling the truth is the best thing. We are going to try and get the DNA report through the solicitors so we can see how detailed it is. If that's possible? Also had a thought that maybe she made this up because she was annoyed they DIDN'T have sex. Therefore making it more important to tell the truth.

I was also wondering if anyone knows roughly how long it takes for the trial to begin once you've pleaded not guilty? Is it a matter of weeks or months?

I am finding this harder to cope with because we are still waiting for a meeting with the solicitor, only had phone calls so far. He has a meeting with the barrister this week so hopefully that'll help. If that's no good we will look in to changing. Did think that it odd that he's meeting up with the barrister before the solicitor though.

brokengirlfriend, 13 months is such a long road. Is it his trial next week? I don't think I'll ever understand what goes through these girls heads, they are ruining people's lives. What makes it worse is that they can get away with it too

[brokengirlfriend]

Hi,
Yes it was january last year he got charged and yes his trial is next week, he pleaded not guilty and 13 months later it is finally going to crown court after 13 months of complete hell my bf has had to take so much time off work. It is terrible that these girls/women are ruining peoples lives for a bit of attention im going to have everything crossed next week and will keep my head held high and stare the liar in her eyes to show she will not win! just keep on supporting your boyfriend and remember the truth always comes out!

[veryworriedgirlfriend]

Boyfriend has now had a meeting with solicitor (not barrister as previously told). She has passed over the statements and DNA evidence to him. The DNA report is so confusing and conflicting. It states there is no possibility he ejaculated inside her (which goes against her statement). But because there is evidence of a trace of semen it says it could have been transferred 2 ways - from another part of the body (ie. hands) or it could be from sexual intercourse. There appears to be a scale of 7 levels of strength on how likely it is that they had sex, they started they believe it strongly indicates that penetrative sex took place, a level 4 on the scale. How can they deduce that when they've pointed out its such a small amount, it could have been transferred another way and there's no evidence of him ejaculating inside her? How accurate are these tests?

I am really struggling with all of this now and having read the statements feel like the system is far too much in favour of the girl. She even gets to not be present in court so I don't get to look the liar in the eye, he doesn't have that 'get out' option

[Casehardened]

Once again I have to be fairly blunt in my response, and I'm sorry for this, my words are directed at him not yourself.

Only two people know what actually happened in the room, your boyfriend and the girl.

If he denies having intercourse and the jury decide from the girl's statement and the DNA evidence that intercourse did take place, then they may wonder why he is denying it.

If he now changes his statement and says intercourse did take place, this change of statement will doubtless be highlighted by the prosecution and again the jury may wonder why he initially denied intercourse took place.

I fear he is between a rock and a hard place, undoubtedly whatever sexual activity took place was with consent and now, for whatever reason, the girl has withdrawn this consent.

It would be helpful if he could think of a motive for this change of heart (for instance is she his ex and is jealous of his new relationship)

Apart from this I can only reiterate my previous advice that he is far less likely to be tripped up in the witness box if his defence is based on the truth. Remember that neither the police nor the solicitor will have to decide on his guilt or innocence but 12 ordinary folk such as you and me.

[grababadger]

Who is to say she didnt have sex with someone else that night, hence the chances of penetration quite high. His sperm could have easily been transferred by herself. Sounds to me like he needs to stick to his original statement. One possibility could be that, maybe she was annoyed if he refused to give her penetrative sex as she wanted to get pregnant?