New to this ...Help...advise...what to do? Scotland

[can it get worse]

Hi all,

What a rollercoaster this is and I hate them at the best of times!! The last month or so has been a complete low for me, my confidence in everything disappeared, my trust in anything and anyone was pretty non existent and I felt like I could no longer cope...poor eating and sleeping probably didn't help, losing a stone in weight (which I didn't really need to lose) in two weeks is never the best way to lose weight....

Anyways I seem to be coming out the other side, a good talking to from mum about getting some fighting spirit back and a couple of counselling sessions (god they are hard work!!) seem to be picking me up.

I have been trying to keep away from here, the support is tremendous and the knowledge that people here have a true understanding of how you are feeling can really help, but I was spending too much time trawling through this and other sites and it wasn't helping. I now seem to be able to get things out of my head for periods of time, (I now worry that I am pretending it is not happening!! Yes, I am a worrier!!) It is all outwith my control and until the Fiscal decides whether or not to proceed with the FA it seems life is just to carry on as normal...not easy.

Just wanted to update everyone with the fact that nothing is happening, my complaint about being harassed by the accuser has gone unacknowledged - why I would expect anything else I don't know - and to apologise for not posting, I hope everyone on here is ok, has support around them and good legal advise. I want to post on here more and try to show others the support they have shown me, I just dont want to be all consumed by this terrible situation we all find ourselves in.

Love to all CGU xx

Hi CGU - you sound just like me. Worrying about every little eventuality. I'm now worrying that I'm worrying too much!!!! I suppose because we are so powerless in all this and the accuser seems to hold all the power, I feel compelled to search on the web for some positives.

[saddened]

Terrible story of Injustice - Production company advertising to expose injustice... If anybody is interested?

All,

Please see the link and the injustice of a poor soul falsely convicted and fighting for justice. http://www.insidetime.org/articlevie...of_paul_wynter

At the bottom of the article there is a production company saying that they want to produce documentaries and studies to to expose even some of these dreadful injustices. They say they have considerable experience in this field producing documentaries and publishing on these subjects, along with contact details etc.

I have certainly taken note and look forward to the end productions. At the moment I feel like being a guest star as the whole thing has been shocking....

Saddened

[cantgiveup]

Hi CGU - you sound just like me. Worrying about every little eventuality. I'm now worrying that I'm worrying too much!!!! I suppose because we are so powerless in all this and the accuser seems to hold all the power, I feel compelled to search on the web for some positives.

Yep, CIGW that is pretty much it, worrying how the children will cope,worrying you are worrying too much, worrying you are not worrying enough, worrying what people might say think, worrying what the outcome will be, worrying when the outcome be, worrying if there will be any part of you left by the time it ends....and all the time a single parent of 4 children, working and trying to get through the day to day stuff. But somehow there is no choice but do it, some days are much worse than others and some days are ok.

I hope all is as wel as can be with you and yours.

CGU xx

[can it get worse]

All,

Please see the link and the injustice of a poor soul falsely convicted and fighting for justice. http://www.insidetime.org/articlevie...of_paul_wynter

At the bottom of the article there is a production company saying that they want to produce documentaries and studies to to expose even some of these dreadful injustices. They say they have considerable experience in this field producing documentaries and publishing on these subjects, along with contact details etc.

I have certainly taken note and look forward to the end productions. At the moment I feel like being a guest star as the whole thing has been shocking....

Saddened

Hi Saddened,

Thank you for that - I've read the link that you suggested - it is shocking and very very saddening. Although the more I read about these investigations, it changes my outlook on the whole system. So I'm left despairing about the situation we are in. We felt slightly confident that there would not be sufficient evidence to charge because there was so much info to the contrary but here we are now with a charge on our hands. And I do accept CPS are in a very difficult position at the moment due to their past reputation, current climate etc.

Ben Gunn's story also makes interesting reading in respect of the police. My partner recently had the opportunity of meeting him.

Regarding the 'production' ......... it seems they'll be many people who are in a position to audition!!!!! It could have more episodes than 'The Bill'

[can it get worse]

Yep, CIGW that is pretty much it, worrying how the children will cope,worrying you are worrying too much, worrying you are not worrying enough, worrying what people might say think, worrying what the outcome will be, worrying when the outcome be, worrying if there will be any part of you left by the time it ends....and all the time a single parent of 4 children, working and trying to get through the day to day stuff. But somehow there is no choice but do it, some days are much worse than others and some days are ok.

I hope all is as wel as can be with you and yours.

CGU xx

Hi CGU........... Yes exactly. If it wasn't so scary - it's almost funny. But not really funny at all as I no longer truly laugh. Before all this I wasn't really a worrier but now....... well....... my frown lines are deepening with each passing day!!!! And today has been horrible on the inside - normal to the outside And I'm totally worn out & tired with it all.....but will face another day tomorrow and the next and the next in order to protect the ones that matter. Meanwhile the accuser's life is barely affected by this. Another frown line in the making!!!!!!

[cantgiveup]

Update

Hi all, although I havent been keeping in touch I have been reading posts, just not felt able to give anyone any constructive support. The last year has changed me forever and I dont think I will ever be the same again. I have managed to build myself up a little and do feel a bit stronger, I am going to have to be as 10 months after the alleged incident my partner was charged. 3 months on and nothing else has happened, no plea date, no court date - nothing.

3 months on no statements have been submitted to the defence despite numerous requests and I have been requested to attend a second precognition interview by the Procurator Fiscal. Apparently there are half a dozen points the Fiscal wants me to clarify. Surely 14 months is long enough to 'investigate'?!

This is the cruellest system, there are lots of children involved on both sides and trying to protect them from this is so hard, especially when the FA is carrying on her life as if nothing happened.

Again, sorry for not posting recently, I am sorry to see so many new members and wish old and new strength and hope in their own circumstances.

CGU xx

[can it get worse]

Hi CGU - no need to apologise...........I feel exactly the same. Feel deflated and fed up.

It is torture with the waiting. And further down the line as we've both said before - the worry still exists.

So sorry that this isn't moving faster for you. Stay strong

[is there justice?]

Hi CGU

It's an awful ordeal, considered guilty before proving innocence and the FA presumed a victim before proved a liar. Keep your chin up and stay strong

[cantgiveup]

Thanks ITAJ and CIGW - second precognition statement done, it was much different from the last statements I have given where I felt I was being led to say things against my partner, this time, they appeared to listen to me, it felt more like a character statement rather that any direct questioning about what actually happened. It was very strange.

Hope all is well with you and yuors and you are having more 'up' days than 'down' ones.

CGU xxx

[lawlessone2009]

From the 'other posters' thread:

I think I have found some of what I had read regarding the appeal with regards 'time bar'.

I have not found the appeal yet though...

So:

http://www.lemac.co.uk/resources/gui..._procedure.htm

3:6.3 Commencement of proceedings

Solemn proceedings normally commence on the date of whichever the following happens first:

(a) the grant of a petition warrant to arrest and commit the accused;
(b) the intimation of the petition;
(c) the service of an indictment (Hamilton v. H.M.Advocate (1996) SCCR 74).


Part (b) is the part you'll be interested in. It's the reading the opener 'date of whichever happens first' and then (b) the intimation of the petition.

Intimation - an indication or hint.


Being held in the court as has happened is the 'indication'. There would've been a private appearance where a brief presentation by the COPFS would've resulted in committal, being placed on petition and bail most likely being put in place. Although the actual appearance never happened it does not change the fact that the 'indication and hint' has happened. There would be no other reason for being taken to court!!!

The tricky part happens further on in the document:

Twelve-Month Limit

Section 65(1) states that an accused person shall not be tried on indictment for any offence unless a trial has commenced within a period of 12 months of the first appearance of the accused on petition in respect of the offence. If the trial has not commenced within that period then the accused:

(a) shall be discharged forthwith from any indictment with respect to that offence; and

(b) shall not at any time be proceeded against on indictment in relation to that offence.

Section 65(10) CP(S)A 1995 states that the only matter which will interrupt the running of the 12 month period is if the accused is detained or remanded (as opposed to sentenced) elsewhere in the UK, Channel Islands or Isle of Man.

This is where the legal argument is! The argument is that 12 months have passed and although a 'petition' was never actually obtained it was clearly indicated by being held in the court cells that one was being sought and for some reason or other was not actually obtained. The intimation is there! The argument is that the Solemn proceedings began on the day of the holding in the court cells and so there is no reason that the 12 month clock did not also start that day.

Print this out and take it to your solicitor for their opinion. I would personally seek the opinion of Mr Nelson but your solicitor would advise on this and it is them that would make the inroads with regards seeking Mr Nelsons opinion.

The sneaky part:

Exemptions

The 12-month rule does not apply to cases reduced from petition to summary.


However, there wouldn't be a reduction to 'summary' for an allegation of rape and there would be obvious arguments if the prosecution where to attempt to charge other than expected. It'd be easily argued.

[cantgiveup]

Many Thanks

Hi Lawlessnessone,

Thanks so very much for taking the time to pass me that info, your a guid ane!!! I have forwarded it on to the lawyer and am keeping everything crossed!!!

Hope all is good with you and thanks again xx

[lawlessone2009]

Hi Lawlessnessone,

Thanks so very much for taking the time to pass me that info, your a guid ane!!! I have forwarded it on to the lawyer and am keeping everything crossed!!!

Hope all is good with you and thanks again xx

Hey,

Only too happy to attempt to help.

The rules are the rules. The High Court in Edinburgh where the appeal would be heard after a failure in the Sheriff Court (guaranteed!) doesn't take too kindly to the COPFS attempting to 'bend' the rules. They will come down hard on them if it can be shown that the rules are not being adhered too. Section 65 is a goldmine for appeals and somewhere that knowledge and experience will win the day. It's the COPFS that are in the wrong!

Remember. The Sheriff always errs on the side of caution where the law is not crystal clear. They will disallow any appeal and leave the 3 judge bench at the appeal court to pass the judgement. The judgement then becomes binding on the lower courts and so the COPFS will more or less be forced to abide by it, they'll simply find another 'grey' area though...........................

Nothing ventured nothing gained.

[cantgiveup]

Hello all,

Sorry for not posting much the last few months, I look in and out, but to be honest I have found that it is not always good for me because I get so wound up by the injustice / unfairness of it all for everyone.....

A wee update though is that there is still no update.....alledged incident was over 18 months ago, bailed for 10 months, charged and then nothing......no idea if or when something will happen. Rediculous. But apparently 'pressure of business' is the cause....

Makes me truly mad.

xx

[cantgiveup]

it is over- not proven

Hi all, there are sadly lots of new faces since I first posted here over two years ago. I wish you all the very best and hope your own nightmare is over soon and justice is done for you.

My partners case finally came to trial at the end of April and after 5 agonising days he was found 'not proven' and acquitted.  not proven was not the verdict I wanted as I felt it would leave an element of doubt in people's mind, but after experiencing the horror of trial not proven is just what it is. Not proven,the burden of proof is on the prosecution and there was not evidence to convict. The only evidence in fact was 'the word' of the complainer. We did not present any defence case, we had no defence witnesses (I was a prosecution witness!) the prosecution barrister actually said when summing up that although the complainer had been proven to not to be credible in some of her evidence 'so what' it did not matter. All that mattered was the actual few minutes they were alone and who they believed, my partner or her?!

Anyway, it is all over for us, I will try and pop in and offer support when I can but my mental and physical health has taken some battering the last two years and for now I am concentrating on getting well again.

I would like to thank everyone here who offered me support, advise and most of all hope especially can it get any worse, my home, frightened spouse and especially lawlessness one for his Scottish input.

Hope you all stay strong and continue to fight, it is hard and energy sapping but that positive outcome is out there and there are people out there too who believe in you ️Xxx

[can it get worse]

Hi CGU - lovely to hear from you and especially the good news that you bring. That's fantastic - well done.

The state of mind after this experience takes it toll for a great length of time. I still shudder with the whole circus and go cold thinking about what we had to endure. I've read back thru your thread and have palpitations reading thru our communications. What worriers we are !!!

However - it is over. It is so important to try to put this behind you. Logical words from me but I've still not tackled it very well!

Take time to recover - and enjoy the rest of your lives.

Bestest Wishes xxx