Appeal

[sad person 6]

Hello

I just thought i would share with you some good news i have had.You may remember me saying my brother was convicted of rape in july 2005,and that he was awaiting a appeal.Well on friday we heard that his appeal has been passed by the first judge now awaiting until it goes before the three main judges.We no its a long way off and we are not getting to excited (well im trying not to )but we thought it was a good start.

x

[Saffron]

That is absolutely excellent news!
So many people automatically assume that every convicted person has the right of appeal, but this is not the case. I am so glad that you have found possible grounds for an appeal, and that it has passed the first stage. Please do let us know what happens.

I know there is a long road ahead, but if there is even the tiniest chance of justice being done, it is totally worthwhile. Stay strong.

Lots of happy, positive thoughts,

Saffron x

[geraldine]

Hi Sad,

Hope you've read the outcome of my partners trial, you were all right, he was found guilty. I've never been through such a traumatic experience, how he must be feeling is unimaginable. He had been remanded so he's not just been thrown in at the deep end as such, he was 10 months ago, but as with being innocent he thought he would be out, that the truth would all come out. How wrong we all were!

23rd December aswell, he only rang for a minute on Christmas day and me crying throughout probably didnt help him mentally. He had used all his phone credit the week of the trial, thinking he wouldnt be needing no more, he brought all his letters & photo's to court thinking he'd be home. they wouldnt let him take any back. And he cannot order phone credit until today but he wont receive that until next Tuesday.

He said that he spoke to his barrister after Court about appealing, and said to me he is going to fight this all the way. However; i can see from what you have said & from FASO that isnt an easy thing! How can you find fresh evidence when everyone who had been in the flat that night turned up at court & told the truth - except for her obviously.

Do you mind me asking you how you went about it? Can anyone give me some good advice? I know you only have 28 days & what with it being chrstmas it seems so unfair as the solicitors wont be open until 03/01/06 and we will have lost loads of time.

Please help me if you can.

[sad person 6]

Geraldine
My brothers case was awful from start to finish,everything that could go wrong did and like you she sat that crying for the whole time.When put under pressure she just cried louder and didnt end up answering the question.She lied or could not remember,her witnesses are drug addicts but none of this was bought up the have crimminal records but again these were not bought up but my brothers were.This was unfair because the wanted to discredit my brother to show he was not of good charecter but the same should have applied to them.
My brothers appeal is on pressure of time.The jury had been out 2 days on the friday at 4.30pm the judge bought them back and said have you made a decision on which at least 10 of you agree(we were down to 11 jury members as one got discharged)the jury clearly said no.the judge then said given more time do you think if i bring you back monday you will all agree.The jury were all looking at the two men that sat in the front it was embarresing for them.Then the judge said you can go back to your room to see if comming back next week you will all agree.
They had been gone 1 minute 58 seconds there was a knock on the door with a verdict.My brothers barrister was going mad he was saying they didnt go down to get a verdict they had clearly said they did not have one.He asked if they could be bought back on monday anyway because it would be fair to my brother and also it would take any pressure off the jury the judge said no
Verdict Guilty
Totally out of order but my brother is paying the price he got 6 years all we praye is his appeal is successful
Sad

[geraldine]

Hi

Something a little similar, but not quite if you know what i mean.

We too only had 11 in the Jury, one was discharged. One woman at front cried throughout which i think had an effect of the rest of them. But the Jury were discharged on Friday 23rd at about 11.30. He told them that they would have as long or as little as they needed to decide, then said they had to make a decision today as the courts would be closed until January. But they were only out for about 2 and a half hours. That would be no time to examine all the evidence, a verdict based on emotion id say. They all came back in clutching their bags & coats as if they had to all dash into town before the shops shut to do last minute christmas shopping, they didnt even want to sit down on their seats for the verdict to be read!

I dont know if this will be mentioned in the appeal, id say it was the biased onesided summing up by the Judge.

Has your brother had to go on the sex offenders register? It seems this is more a burden than the sentence! If we could afford a private solicitor & not legal aid im sure a lot of us wouldnt be in this situation, legal aid doesnt pay enough for solicitors to do indepth investigations.

[sad person 6]

Yes geraldine he has to be on there for the rest of his life.We are just waiting for a appeal date as he has got past the first judge but we are not getting our hopes up.
You take care if you need to talk im here
x

[jools 1]

Hi Geraldine, and all others out theee going throught his,

I went to see G on Saturday - It was SO good to see him. The three weks he has been in there is the longest time we've ever been apart.

He is on the S.O. register for life. He also told me that if I or his daughter have children - he may not be able to have contact with them! Does anyone know if this is right? He too has been told about the course he will have to do for parole and that he has to change his plea to guily - which he will NOT do - He said he will do the full 5 years as there is NO way that he is going to admit to anything he hasn't done. Very hard as 2.5 years is bad enough but 5 years -I'm not sure how he, me, his parents and friends will cope.

I'm trying not to think about his appeal as there is no guarantee that it will go through etc - I am trying to concentrate on keeping in touch with him, arranging visits - which is a nightmare and just adjusting to getting through each day.

I SO know what you are going through right now and you're right - it's awful to say but it does help that others are in the same boat..... But, together we can all keep each other going.

Hope you stay in touch.X

[sad person 6]

Jools
Only if your boyfriends conviction has anything to do with children would they stop him,otherwise he would be ok.As for the parole if he does not do the cousre he can still go for parole but it would be unlikely he would get it because they would say he has not admitted his guilt.(my brother will not do the course either,and i dont blame him)He will still get released at the 2 third stage which is 3 years even if he does not do the course because that will be his release date,but he will be on licience when he gets released.(my brother got 6 years will do 4 but is on licience for 6 months on his release.)
Hope this helps
Im here if you want to talk
sadperson

[Guest_geraldine]

We seem to be all in a similar boat - mine has to serve 6yrs 8 months. He has now done 10 months on remand. I take it that although he may go for parole, hes unlikeley to ever get it & therefore have to serve this length of time. Someone said he could be out in 5, but again i presume thats if he does the course, which he definately will NEVER do. He was scared that he would have to serve the whole of the 10 years if he doesnt admit, but from what you say Sad Person this is wrong.

As for the SO register, i've tried looking on a few sites but cant really find anything in plain english that explains what he has to do. If he was to go & live in Ireland on his release how would that effect him?
I'm relieved that he wont be bothered by the Children thing, i've heard a few things like he'l be classed as being in there "concern" register for the 18 years of childs life, but again cant confirm thats true.

Its not just them things that it will effect. How will he ever gain employment again? He's already been given the knock back in jail from doing a long carpentry course - sorry not open to S O.

Also, i know when people have long sentences they can apply to get day release after theyve done about 2/3 years. Is it because of the crime they have been found guilty of that they'll never get this? I know a lad who got about 8 years for dealing drugs & he's only done about 2 years and he gets to come out 1 weekend in every month! I suppose it will come back to this - only if he admits guilt & does the course senario again!

Glad I've people to talk to.

I'm sure i'll be asking you more things before the week is out!

Bye x

[Saffron]

Good luck Jools and Sadperson. I really hope the appeals procedure goes your way. There is no way your loved ones should feel obliged to admit guilt in order to secure an early release. The system sucks. The same as the trial - if my husband had pleaded Guilty, he probably would not have gone to jail. But because he "put his victim through the trauma of a trial" the judge said a custodial sentence was unavoidable.

i am thinking of you both.

[sad person 6]

Geraldine
On his release he will be visited by someone im not sure if its probation or a police liasion officer,i was so annoyed at court at this point i think i stopped listening.what happens on his release is the police need to no where he is living and where he is working thats if he ever can get a job.(my brother is lucky there his job is waiting for him when he gets home)If he want to go on holiday or move the police need to no where he is.That is all they have to do.If they are released on licence then they will have to meet with a probation officer when they are told but i have spoken to probation and they said that they would not demand to see them at a certain time if they had a job ect because it is supposed to be a positive thing.The police just want to no where he is living he does not have to sign on at a police station or anything like that.
The prison my brother is in is ok as far as prisons go,they are all treated well there is no bullying,they are encouraged to work (my brother is doing a plastering course).He told them from the start he is not doing the s o course and he has told his probation officer he would rather stay in prison then change his plea so he will not go for porole.She told him not to think like that ,but thats the way he feels and to be honest i dont blame him.
Im here if you want to talk
sadperson

[sad person 6]

SAFFRON
It makes you sick doesn't it the truma you put the victim through.What about the truma your poor husband went through,you take care of yourself and each other at least you were both strong enough to get through it.What makes you even more sick is when you see the alleged victim swaning around without a care in the world

Thanks for your kind words
SADPERSON

[Saffron]

Hello everyone, Sad Person, Geraldine and Jools

When R was in prison, i developed a few coping strategies which were really useful for both of us. As your loved ones have been on remand for a while, you may have already done these, but just in case....

i phoned BT and managed to get a "call divert" set up on my home phone. they gave me a special code to type into the phone if i was going out. this meant that he could dial the home number, and the call would automatically get diverted to my mobile. He would only pay the cost of the call to the home number, and I was billed for the cost of the divert from the home phone to my mobile. It ended up costing me about ?12 a month, and saved him a fortune in phone credit.

At first i tried to write every day, but what with caring for our child and working full time, this proved too difficult. what i did instead was kept a "diary" of sorts, and wrote a bit each day, posting the "diary" to him every few days.

I arranged for a newspaper to be delivered to him every day. Most prisons have a local newsagent who delivers to them, and you can order them a month at a time. Knowing i was giving him a creature comfort, however small, was in turn a great comfort to me.

I posted him photos of our home and garden so that he could remember what our home was like, and hopefully feel closer to us.

I went to my GP and was referred to an excellent charity counsellor. Some people find it helpful and some don't, but you wont know unless you try. I know that the injustice of everything burned like acid in me, and it still does. i have learned to control it, but it was incredibly difficult, and at times i thought it would bury me. The only thing that kept me going was knowing that i had to stay strong for our child and for R.

I developed distraction strategies for times when i was scared or incredibly angry, and used to do something very physical (paint a room, spring clean, swim etc) which took my mind off things and gave me something else to focus on.

Like I said, R wasn't on remand, he was on bail, so when he was jailed it was a real culture shock. I had never met anyone who had even been in prison before, and had no experience of what it was like to have a loved one taken from me like that. Your loved ones have been on remand, so you have probably already had to go through that shock of seperation. maybe I haven't given you any new ideas, but if there is anything I can do, please ask.

thinking of you all.

[sad person 6]

saffron
Thank you
Like you my brother was on bail so it was a shock to use and him when they took him away.I am finding it harder as time goes by not easier,he has been gone 6 months next week it feels like a lifetime.I dont no how i will cope if his appeal is not successful and he has to do 4 years,it dont bear thinking about.

Thanks for your tips,the one about the phone is so good i have told my brothers wife that because she does not like to leave the house incase she misses his call,he is not allowed to ring a mobile?

We do send him pictures,that is such a good idea about the diary,my brothers son is keeping a scrape book for his daddy,he is only just 5 and thinks his dad is away working.

It is hard not to think of anything else but him but we do try cause as you no life has to go on.

Thanks again saffron its nice to hear from someone who has been through it and come out the other side,a stronger person i bet

sadperson

[Saffron]

Hello

I know its tough, incredibly difficult, but you will get through it. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

our son also thought his daddy was away for work, and it was very difficult. has your brother asked about the possibility of some home leave? it is really difficult to get, and he will have to jump through a load of hoops, but he may be able to get it.

R got some home leave when i had to go to hospital for some pre-cancer treatment. It was deemed to be "compassionate grounds". He didn't have to admit "guilt" or anything like that, but he did have to undergo a risk assessment. He also had to be given both planned and random drug tests. we found out the leave had been approved at 5pm the day before he was hoping to come home. nothing like leaving it til the last minute. he was allowed home for 3 days, (2 nights) and it wonderful to see him without that awful prisoners visiting "bib" on. R said that going back to the prison was the hardest thing he has ever had to do, including going through the trial, but that it was worth it. He wasn't tagged.

Your brother can get his solicitor to make an application for home leave, or ask his probation officer. My husband's case may be different to your brothers - for example, R was allowed to make ohone calls to any number he liked, including mobiles. His sentence was less than 2 years, which does make a difference on some things.

Going to visit him was a bittersweet experience. It was always wonderful to see him. I found strange things the most difficult. He smelled institutionalised - not of his usual showergel and aftershave. he was incredibly pale and thin. the chairs in the visiting room were really uncomfortable, and we weren't allowed to share any food, not even a bag of crisps. i wasn't allowed to put my fingers up his sleeve and stroke his arm. and leaving him in that vile place was the hardest, and the rage still boils inside me when i think about it.

I understand how it feels, and my heart goes out to you. If there is anything I can do, let me know.

Saffron x