my 16 year old son falsely accused of rape by a woman of 40

[gareth589]

Hello Landlady and Son...

I have been reading a great deal in to this Bi Polar and the effects. There is a great deal of medicial evedience, While I am no expert, you can go round the twist trying to gain answers for the facts. It is down to you to raise these thoughts to you sons Legal Team, as any Barrister worth his weight will know the Case Law and be-able to find cases that the issues reflect to.

I am not a mother but a father to a 16month old and the love i have to her is something special and unique so for you as a mum it must be hard.
Please Landlady focus on gathering the evedience, but let your Legal Team fight, be there to oversee and dont be afraid to push them harder and dont be afraid to question, but from watching a Barrister at work in the Court, thes people are highly clever and really show that they are in a different league to that of a Solicitor.

I have lost the woman I loved so much because of my bad ways and lost my daughter and home. I have found references to Bi Polar and now question, could I suffer with this.

You have to be strong for your family, and no doubt in my mind the poor lad for his first time has had a rotten deal at the hands of this nutter, but looking at this womans so called boyfriend is not helping you. You need to focus on the facts within her statment, one by one go through them, and it may help to list your sons feeling and views to each point raised, It may be hard to want to put your views, but dont, let your lad do this. It may help his defence that due to his age that how he has responded, in the eyes of the jury, they could look at his age her age, the fact he is a minor and she has many years more life experience. Jurys are all people from different walks of life.

I dont want you to think i am being harsh, but i am trying to show you that there is light and your defence can come from many different angles. Your legal team will do all they can, Although its life, Barristers see each case as a contest or a game and they dont like to loose.

Be strong and remember I am behind you 100%

Gareth

[worriedfather]

it ok to rant

Hi Landlady
feel free to rant, its ok it makes you feel better. My son was 18 when he was accused so i understand how you feel. It is very frustrating as they wont give you answers. read through all the evidence, we got some paper and wrote a timeline down to highlight the things that were wrong. Your sol can apply for her medical file and please do check what happens with the combination of drugs, my son was given diazepam and he was on antidepressants which causes the person to feely very sleepy and compliant.
My son admitted lying in court and was found not guilty, your sol and Barrister will highlight the stuff that does not add up and i am sure will make a big thing of the age difference and her behaviour. Keep coming on here there are plenty of wise people. Good luck

[friday]

A someone with Bipolar who has seen what defence barristers do to discredit people with mental health conditions you can be sure they will make her look like a complete lunatic (which in your son's case sounds about right!). The defence in my case just read out the DSM-IV (the mental disorders manual) and did not allow me to bring in anyone to confirm the severity of my illness or even that i was not having an episode at the time of the assault (I had a very severe episode AFTER the assault but had not previously been admitted to hospital).

We aren't doctors and can't be diagnosing based on information over the internet for definite! but if you get access to medical records and believe there may be an underlying borderline personality disorder then you need to be looking for the words "emotionally unstable personality disorder/traits" as EUPD is the ICD-10 classifcation of borderline and most medical professionals are now using this term due to the stigma of borderline.

I would assume from the meds this woman is taking she has a less severe (or bipolar II) form but it may be worth finding out how long she has been on this med combination and if prozac is a new treatment. if it is, it is possible it has triggered an episode, although this all obviously hypothetical. If you can find out it may be important to know if she has a rapid (or ultra-rapid) cycling form or even it has a seasonal component (e.g. mania in summer, depression in winter). Just a few ideas for things that might be worth looking into.

Just to bear in mind for anyone reading this and wondering about bipolar: No two people with bipolar (or any mental illness) will have the exact same symptoms or require the exact same treatment. Just because one person has hallucinations doesn't mean another will, one person might have debilitating manias whereas another will have debilitating depressions, some people regularly have mixed episodes, others never will, some people have long periods or wellness whereas others may always have residual symptoms or frequent episodes, some people can hold down a full-time job whereas others need full-time care. Just felt the need to add a bit of balance to the 'bipolar makes you a loon' post...

[RFLH]

thanks Friday - always good to see a different perspective on points.

Having had an 'episode' early this year I can say that I only have vague memories of three months of my life - I know we had Christmas, but I have no recollection of it.

Nothing is simple when it comes to the mind - everyone reacts differently to drugs.

[largactyl1]

Yes, t'is true, everyone is different. Excellent pointers on Borderline Personality Disorder there Friday.
I am very aware I can be very damning of people with Personality Disorders - it's definitely not fair of me, but every single person I have met with Borderline PD turns out to be a drama loving,soul sapping pain in the *rse. And in the case of A's accuser, downright dangerous.

Anyway, some excellent pointers for Landlady and her team.

[landlady]

hi Friday,
it appears she has been on this medication for some time, or so she told the examining doctor at the rape center. she also said she has never known to have any reaction before. maybe if we obtain the medical records it may tell us more. thankyou for your help its very useful.

takecare Landlady x

[landlady]

once again thank you all for your continued support, it truley does warm my heart to know you all care about my son.

the last few days have been rough, he's very down and wants to cry but holds it in, even though we urge him to let it out.

he filled his sheet in for his councillor. any of you that have had councillin will know which sheet i mean.

it asks lots of questions about the way you are feeling and how strong those feelings are.

my heart broke all over again when i looked at it. i never thought my lovely fun loving shy but happy son would ever feel so low.

he took a sleeping tablet tonight that the doctor gave him. i hope it helps him get some sleep. but from what he tells me even that at times can be worse than being awake!

i'm waiting for our solicitors assistant to ring us to go over there to write " TIME LINES"

does anyone know what these are??

our solicitor has gone sick with chest pains!

thats just about my son's luck!!!!!!!!!
sorry that sounds so selfish.
anyway thanks to you all for your great support it is very much appreciated.


take care Landlady

[friday]

I'm not a solicitor but a solicitor did a time line with me (for a housing matter but i assume it is similiar). It was just a list of where I was at a given point in time and what was going on. In your sons case I would hazard a guess this would be confined to the night in question but if she was known to your family it could also be a time line of your meetings, what she was doing, if there were any arguments etc.

an example would look like this:
01.01.10
4.15pm-Walking the dog in Woof Park. Met Pat and talked about his pet cat which had recently died.
4.50pm-Saw Pat doing a handstand in his garden. Thought it was a bit odd but Pat has been known to practice gymnastics in public
5.30pm-Got home, noticed a handwritten letter had been put through the letterbox. It wasn't there when I left to walk the dog.
5.35pm-Sat at the kitchen table with a cup of tea and opened the letter. It was from Pat and said he was joining the circus. This was not typical Pat.
5.40pm-Left the house to go find Pat.
6.50pm-Pat wasn't in his garden. Knocked on the door and got no answer. All the lights were out and it was dark so I assumed he wasn't home.
6.55pm-Rang his wife and told her I was worried and that he left a letter saying he was joining the circus.

From this we can see that Pat was last seen at 4.50pm and could only have been missing for 2 hours. This is very important to know if we are worried about Pat as it will give us an idea of how far he could have gone in that time. The conversation about his pet cat could be important as he may be emotionally vulnerable and it could possibly help us find him if he, for example, enjoyed watching a particular circus on TV with his cat.

You get the picture. Sorry for the random example. I am sleep deprived.

[landlady]

thanks for the explanation Friday,

the only problem may be that on the night in question time was the last thing on a young lad of sixteen at a party's mind!!

he only remembers what time he left and the inbetween bit is just guessed.

[Rights Fighter]

Then talk to others who were at the party who MIGHT remember what went on. Don't forget kids have mobile phones and take all sorts of randmon photos.

[landlady]

no photo's senior member except one of her sat on the floor with her head hung down lookin a mess, although that could be the answer to her stiff neck or whiplash as she called it!!

we have asked everyone we can no one seems to remember, even in statements everyone has said different times, they were all so drunk when they left the pub never mind at 2.30 in the morning, and a lot of them had left. my son and his mate were the only ones sober when they left the pub although my son had had a few ciders when he had finished work at about 11.

i'v tried for almost a year now to make some sence of it but i'v not learnt anymore from any of them at all.

her statement obviously tells more but all lies!!!

[Rights Fighter]

Just so you know my name is not "senior member".

I suggested that others might remember or that kids might have taken photos because that is what often happens at event such as this. It is up to you to cosider this advice.

You really should be thinking as to how the Crown might present this evidence re:

her sat on the floor with her head hung down lookin a mess,

no one seems to remember, even in statements everyone has said different times, they were all so drunk when they left the pub never mind at 2.30 in the morning,

They will concentrate on this and ignore anything that you might say.

You can take this advice or ignore it. It is entirely up to you.

[landlady]

sorry about the name, i am so tired, easy mistake,Rights Fighter.

please explain what you mean i don't understand????

you asked about photo's i was telling you the only one anyone has is what i told you. yes she looked a mess is that what you mean it would go against my son???

what advise have you given that i have not understood??

[landlady]

i have said something that has offended you Rights Fighter??

i was trying to explain what i know, do you not think i have asked and asked and asked the others over and over again.

i know that her being drunk can go against my son, but by the time they had sex so was he.

i'm going to bed a little offended by your comments.

[Rights Fighter]

Sorry you are offended.

Some people take random photos at parties and other events that years ago would have been considered inappropriate. I was thinking that maybe somebody had snapped them having sex which would show she was enjoying it rather than being forced.

A photo of her sitting looking a mess could be construed by the Crown as

a: proving she was so drunk she could not have given consent

b: she got even more drunk after the alleged rape because she was so "traumatised".

You'll find that these days, trashing a complainant's character in court is rarely going to happen unless it relates to making similar allegations and then usually only if the allegations went as far as a complaint to the police. Bringing in a complainant's mental illness is not supposed to be derogatory to the complainant, although she may think it is. it can help the defence case because often what they have told their counsellor is different to what was said in her statement and/or at trial.

If you want to bring in certain evidence, before you do so, think "how would the Crown make use of this?" Believe me, I've attended enough trials to know that what you might think will help, could have the reverse effect.

I am not sticking up for the complainant here, but saying it as it is. Some people do not like this sort of advice but once it gets to court they realise that it is basically correct.

I attended a trial last year where the defendant's wife took umbrage at the advice I gave. After her husband was convicted she had the decency to apologise and say that she was wrong and wished she had taken heed. Another guy whose trial was heard early this year complained bitterly about his defence team (mainly because his barrister was a woman and he disapproved of women being in such a position of "power"). I tried to explain that her tactics were actually in his favour and of course he disagreed (probably because I am "female" - as he refers to us ladies). He was found not guilty and the trial judge said that the case should never have come to court and could easily have been remedied by marriage counselling. I had said that months before the trial. RFLH will know who I mean.

This is why I now tend to say, "this is the advice, it is your choice whether you take it or leave it".