confident but still scared

[macdougal]

A week ago yesterday I dropped my daughter off at her mums and decided id get in touch with an old mate and go for a few pints. so we met up and went into the local town. my friend told me to text a girl ho we were both friends with and see if she wanted to come and meet us. she was out with friends in another area of the place we live and said she'd come pick us up to have a drink with them. we agreed and she came to get us at around 11 oclock. when we got to where her friends were she picked one of them up and said as its getting late and its a weekday shall just get beers and go back to "macdougals" house. So we went to a local 24 hour garage, my friend and i got some cans of lager and the girls friend got a bottle of vodka and some coke and we went to my house. i keep snakes, so when we first went in the house i got a couple of them out to show them all and then after a short time put them back, then started playing guitar in the kitchen. the drivers friend came out into the kitchen (the oly place i smoke in the house) and after a few songs we were talking about music and the snakes, we then started kissing for no apparant reason really it just happened. After a while of kissing SHE said lets go upstairs and being a single mid 20's man who's going to refuse. We got to the bedroom had a few kisses and a laugh and she shut the door and we ended up on the bed undressing. we had intercourse but for some reason (whether it be alcohol or lack of genuine attraction) i kept losing my erection. After several attempts to bring it back, including oral, we decided to give up and we lay there talking, she was telling me how nice it was that i looked after my daughter full time. and then i fell asleep.
Next thing theres on a knock on my door at 5am in the morning so i look out the window and its police, go to answer the door and they arrest me on suspicion of rape.
after 12 hours in the cell i see my solicitor who advises me to tell the investigating officers exactly what i told him because he genuinely believed my story. so in my interview the CID officers were friendly and afterwards said that they believed me and even waited around for 3 hours after their shift to give me a lift home. (as well as one of them takin me out to the yard for a smoke, which was one of her own) on the journey home they kept re-assuring me that i didnt have much to worry about. They had taken statements from one of my friends (the driver, also friends with the girl who made the allegations) and her story coincided with mine not the accussee.
I rang the officers monday for an update and she was still very positive in my favour. They also took a statement from my friend monday and the first thing he said when he sat down was " listen, ive known "macdougal" for 6 years and he has not done anything wrong she is lying" and they said we know she is, we just need your statement. so he gave his statement and afterwards told him to tell me not to worry too much, they cant see it going anywhere but obviosuly the final decision is with the crown prosecution service.
despite all this positivity, my lack of faith in the justice system (which im hoping is brought back) is keeping me in a worried state and i just want it all to be over. any advice on coping would be appreciated and also anyone else had this kind of response from the investigating officers before?
regards to all

[RFLH]

Beware of friendly plod, some genuinely are but ....

To be honest I'd get your witnesses to make statements on your behalf and write down everything that you can remember. It's better to have a record of this now whilst you can remember all the details - just in case.

Until you've heard that you've been NFA'd then take nothing for granted.

[macdougal]

even though all statements are in you'd advise me to get everyone to write the events down anyway?
in your opinion do you think the accusee getting someone to threaten her friend (the driver) will go for or against me if any impact at all
i cant help but feel that, even though everything ive said is 100% truthful, as is what the witnesses have said, that the cps are a group of people similar to the jury from 12 angry men and that i wont be lucky enough to have a henry fonder amongst them to make them think about things

[Rights Fighter]

even though all statements are in you'd advise me to get everyone to write the events down anyway?
in your opinion do you think the accusee getting someone to threaten her friend (the driver) will go for or against me if any impact at all

What or who do you mean by "accusee"? Do you mean the accuser or accused?

It is always a good idea to ask witnesses to continue to write things down as they remember them. Being interviewed by the police is quite scary and things do get forgotten especially after a few drinks. Memories that were sketchy might return later.

[macdougal]

sorry mate i mean the accuser. Police have said that all enquiries have now been made. The only forensic evidence take from me were swabs from my genital area, but i have admitted to having had sex with girl. What makes me think theyre on my side is that she claimed to be pinching and punching me, whilst being pinned down (which sounds near impossible to me) but police did not check my body for scratch marks or bruises. also ive spoken to a few friends over the last few days who actually know this girl to be a bit of a "slag" and is always sleeping around. each and everyone of them believe that she has done it as an alibi to her boyfriend for actually cheating on him. Will character statements help me in anyway or is just witness statements that are taken into account?

[Rights Fighter]

Being "a bit of a "slag" does not preclude a person from being raped. In fact they are more likely to be abused than a "respectable type" as they are likely to be considered "fair game".

I am surprised that the police did not have you examined for scratch marks. Unfortunately it's a bit late for you to be examined and photographed as any such scratches would have healed so you cannot help yourself in that way.

In case this matter does go further you should also make note of common-sense investigations the police have failed to carry out. You would then have an argument for an abuse of process.

By the way, if you slept with somebody who is known to be "a bit of a slag" and who you had not met before, what does that make you?

Hopefully, next time sex is offered on a plate by somebody you do not know you might have some sense of self respect (not to mention self-preservation) and refuse it.

[macdougal]

I wasnt aware of her background prior to this, its only since the allegation was made that i have found out about her. It was never my intention to sleep with anyone that night, i went out for a beer with my friend to relaxcand have a good time as i work hard looking after my daughter and hadnt really done much socialising (other than with family) oover the christmas period. Even when kissing this girl the thought of sex did not enter my head it was only when she asked me to go upstairs that I had a feeling where it was leading, andf sure enough it did. I consider myself to be a respectful and honest person and have had plenty of female friends alone in my house with nothing happening, because its not my nature to try and sleep with everyone i can. I suppose I was just enjoying the night and the kissing and thats why it went further. I wouldnt be the first or the last to have a one night stand. But it will definately be something i wont be doing again. I have learnt a valuable lesson from this. I can only await the final outcome and hope that the truth is seen

[Saffron]

Hi Macdougal

Please don't beat yourself up about wise/unwise decisions. We all make choices which we can look back on and say "I wish I hadn't...." whatever. Not a lot you can do about that now.

However, calling the accuser's morality into question will not do you any favours, so please drop that line of defence right now. *If* this does go to trial, her sexual history will not be admissible as evidence anyway. Your sexual history, however, will be considered fair game. Not fair I know, but then who said our Justice System was fair?

I echo RF's advice to ask all potential witnesses to write down things they remember. As RF says, being interviewed by PLod is pretty intimidating, and often things can go out of people's minds and then return under less stressful circumstances. I would also urge you to write down as much as you can remember.

Please don't place too much store on the police's assertion that they believe you. They will often say this to get you to drop your guard and confide in them. It may be that they are being genuine, and I sincerely hope they are. But just be careful, that's all I am saying.

Finally, I would just like to say that a lot of people tell women to be careful about being left a lone with a stranger, particularly if they have had a drink. This is valid advice indeed. However, I would also urge all men to be aware that getting intimate with a drunken woman also makes *them* vulberable. Please remember that, as far as drunken sex and the law is concerned, the onus is on the man to ensure he has gained reasonable consent. If he has not gained consent, sexual intercourse is considered to be rape. I am not saying that I agree with this but I am just asking that you blokes are aware that legally speaking this is YOUR responsibility.

Macdougal, I hope this works out as you hope. Look after yourself.

[friday]

^but reasonable consent with drunken sex can mean that the other person (as long as they are alert, not unconscious) did not do or say anything to suggest they were not happy to have sex (i.e. were taking part not just laying there crashed out). at least that was what i gathered from being in court as i was asked what i had done to ensure he knew i didn't consent (although the fact i did make sure he was aware i didn't consent obviously wasn't accepted by the jury and i don't think i will ever understand why not).

although the onus is on the defendent to show they were sure it was consensual the jury also has to be sure that he knew the other person didn't consent so if its a "she was taking part and didn't tell me to stop, or try stop me at any time" argument vs a "i told him to stop and tried to push him off" argument with no other evidence (witnesses, injuries etc) then it is all down to the jury who may either decided they can't be sure (as obviously they weren't there) or may go with whoever they believe even if that is not based on evidence.

hopefully it won't go that far with your case. it is up to the cps to decide if they have a good chance of winning and although cases with purely he said/she said type evidence do go to court I would suspect it makes up a minority of cases (I don't know figures, just making an assumption, correct me if I am wrong)

[macdougal]

Still no updates for me, but is no news good news?
I have been thinking about it a lot, and the more i do the less sense it makes.
I have been speaking to an ex girlfriend who I dated a few months back, briefly, and she knows this girl and all the people she's close to, including the boyfriend, and she said the fact that ive had no threat of violence surprises her greatly as the boyfriend adores her and shes very close with her brother.
The other thing thats been playing on my mind is her boyfriend text the driver of the car asking her who the lads were that they had been with and that he knew i lived at number 8 but not what road. The parents were knocking at number 8 in my road at 4am the same morning, demanding their daughters purse back, (mum was knocking, dad waited in the car) and this strikes me as a strange reaction anyway. I know if it was my daughter id be banging on the door wanting blood not a purse. Even more confusing for me is that number 8 isnt my house and the police came straight to my address and knew my name.
Does this strike anyone as shes said she was raped as an alibi to her boyfriend and when shes thought on, knowing ive done nothing wrong, has told hher family she cant remember the address as she has some concience?
Also, a few people have been looking at her facebook wall and have told me there is no word of any distress, just nights out chippy tea's jokes booking holidays etc. As if she has said what she said and is just getting on with things normal, without a care for the consequences to me. Which one of the consequences is ive had a job offer retracted.
Ive gone past the stage of worrying now, i have some faith in the justice system. I've just become extremely angry that my life, and my daughters life is being affected and its really not fair.
sorry for the rant, not sure if it makes sense but if it does, would like to hear from anyone

[losingthewill]

Hi Macdougal,

No news is not good news. Police will use as much of the bail time as possible. Get your solicitor to call the OIC to find out whats going on. If the CPS think they have a chance then they will charge you with no supporting evidence as it's such a serious complaint and in the public interest so prepare yourself. From my experience witness credibilty (these days) means nothing in these cases. The best advice I can give you is to never trust a police officer, visit your GP and tell him or her whats going on they will be sympathetic despite what you think.

Sorry to be so negative but more and more of these cases go to court (political, thank H Harmen). Try to look after your family as this affects them as much as you I know its difficult.

Still no updates for me, but is no new s good news?
I have been thinking about it a lot, and the more i do the less sense it makes.
I have been speaking to an ex girlfriend who I dated a few months back, briefly, and she knows this girl and all the people she's close to, including the boyfriend, and she said the fact that ive had no threat of violence surprises her greatly as the boyfriend adores her and shes very close with her brother.
The other thing thats been playing on my mind is her boyfriend text the driver of the car asking her who the lads were that they had been with and that he knew i lived at number 8 but not what road. The parents were knocking at number 8 in my road at 4am the same morning, demanding their daughters purse back, (mum was knocking, dad waited in the car) and this strikes me as a strange reaction anyway. I know if it was my daughter id be banging on the door wanting blood not a purse. Even more confusing for me is that number 8 isnt my house and the police came straight to my address and knew my name.
Does this strike anyone as shes said she was raped as an alibi to her boyfriend and when shes thought on, knowing ive done nothing wrong, has told hher family she cant remember the address as she has some concience?
Also, a few people have been looking at her facebook wall and have told me there is no word of any distress, just nights out chippy tea's jokes booking holidays etc. As if she has said what she said and is just getting on with things normal, without a care for the consequences to me. Which one of the consequences is ive had a job offer retracted.
Ive gone past the stage of worrying now, i have some faith in the justice system. I've just become extremely angry that my life, and my daughters life is being affected and its really not fair.
sorry for the rant, not sure if it makes sense but if it does, would like to hear from anyone

[Poncho]

Course of action if charged.

Hi mcdougal.
I went through the hell of 2009 with a false rape accusation over my head. Jury took 35 minutes & acquitted me. My suggestions are below if you are charged.

1.Inform all witnesses now to write down the happenings of the night with the words exchanged (a persons memory does fade) & to keep it safe incase they need it to refresh their memories. This is for your solicitors attention ONLY.

2.It is important for the lady who picked you up state that she made the suggestion to go to your place with her friends & not yours.

3.Police forensics would of gone through or collected your sheets, no fresh semen would of been found there or on/in her body. This is important to state as a rapist wants to ejaculate.

4.When you were being swabbed you would of been stripped, if you had any brusing it would of been noted. As it has not been noted proves your body was mark free which contradicts her statement.

5.She has stated you restrained her, the pressure applied to restrain a person leaves clear bruising/marking & it would not of been present on her. Again a contradicition.

6.They should of took a urine smaple from you for toxicology tests, this will show your blood alcohol level which will support the fact that you had "issues" gaining an erection.

7.Ensure your ex's give character witness statements, to show that you are not an aggressive man when aroused. (This is important).

8.Her sexual history cannot be held against her or mentioned if on trial by law.

Other thoughts below.
Surround yourself with friends & family, I didn't which was a mistake. They will help keep you stable & give treasured emotional support.

Don't think heavily about her activities or her facebook, she is lying so it will be another day for her.

Make sure you solicitor is competent & not trying to angle your case in a way your uncomfortable with.

I think that is enough from me but I hope it is helpful, I wish you well.

[macdougal]

Hi mcdougal.
I went through the hell of 2009 with a false rape accusation over my head. Jury took 35 minutes & acquitted me. My suggestions are below if you are charged.

1.Inform all witnesses now to write down the happenings of the night with the words exchanged (a persons memory does fade) & to keep it safe incase they need it to refresh their memories. This is for your solicitors attention ONLY.

2.It is important for the lady who picked you up state that she made the suggestion to go to your place with her friends & not yours.

3.Police forensics would of gone through or collected your sheets, no fresh semen would of been found there or on/in her body. This is important to state as a rapist wants to ejaculate.

4.When you were being swabbed you would of been stripped, if you had any brusing it would of been noted. As it has not been noted proves your body was mark free which contradicts her statement.

5.She has stated you restrained her, the pressure applied to restrain a person leaves clear bruising/marking & it would not of been present on her. Again a contradicition.

6.They should of took a urine smaple from you for toxicology tests, this will show your blood alcohol level which will support the fact that you had "issues" gaining an erection.

7.Ensure your ex's give character witness statements, to show that you are not an aggressive man when aroused. (This is important).

8.Her sexual history cannot be held against her or mentioned if on trial by law.

Other thoughts below.
Surround yourself with friends & family, I didn't which was a mistake. They will help keep you stable & give treasured emotional support.

Don't think heavily about her activities or her facebook, she is lying so it will be another day for her.

Make sure you solicitor is competent & not trying to angle your case in a way your uncomfortable with.

I think that is enough from me but I hope it is helpful, I wish you well.

Hey cheers poncho, its helped relax me a fair bit. I was concerned about them not taking photos of my body but i now realise why. They didnt take any urine samples from me what-so-ever, but i did state the amount of alcohol i had consumed in my statement, maybe this will be sufficient for them.
its been 4 weeks now, 2 weeks bail left, my friend who works as a prison guard in the remand suite has advised me that he's seen many cases of false allegations and feels that 4 weeks would be plenty of time to process the "evidence" and if they were to charge me it probably would have been done by now. Is this the case do you know? Were you re-arrested when charged or did they wait until you answered bail?

[IAintGoingDown]

Old thread, if you're still around, what happened mate?