How long from "stop" until it is rape

[Pond31]

Hi

I just want to know does anyone know what the time scale between saying "stop" and actually stopping does something become rape? I know if you stop instantly that is not rape, however if you take 10 secs to stop does that still mean rape, or 20 seconds or 30 seconds. Is there a legal timescale. This is just out of interest from a conversation I once had with someone. I am not sure there is a legal timescale.

Pond31

[Franticwithworry]

I don’t think there is a legal timescale. It’s all very subjective. After all, how would people who play sex dominance games or s&m fare? It’s interesting to me that we so rarely (if ever) hear about charges being brought against people who, it could be claimed, took dominance games too far.

The whole notion of criminalising consensual sexual interactions and failing to distinguish between crime and fumbling or immature sex amongst other things - which basically charging ‘regret sex’ situations is doing (again amongst other things) is a minefield.

[HurtandConfused1]

With the deepest respect Pond I don't think you should be writing threads like this when you've two ongoing case.

Consent is a difficult discussion and I think if you're to have any chance to make your two false accusers face justice you need to be focused and not give them any material they can use against you.

[Pond31]

With the deepest respect Pond I don't think you should be writing threads like this when you've two ongoing case.

Consent is a difficult discussion and I think if you're to have any chance to make your two false accusers face justice you need to be focused and not give them any material they can use against you.

With the deep respect to your deepest respect Hurtandconfused. I only have one ongoing case, it is only ongoing because it is so obviously lies that the OIC is not working on it. My first case ended some months ago with an NFA, as it did not pass the evidentiary test. My first FA claimed I sexual assaulted her in her flat on four occasions by going down on her but to get into her flat she had to come down stairs, open the door for me, share the lift with me and let me into her flat. The prosecutor realised that if I had actually sexually assaulted her the first time then why would she let me in the second, third and fourth time. She also sent me multiple sexualized texts ,during and after the events, including one stating that the orgasms she had when I went down on her, and which I was arrested for, were "amazing".

The reason I am asking the question is that there seem to be no set legal limit as casehardened stated. It appears to be if a woman withdraws consent during sex then it should stop as quick as practically possible. The issue is who decides what is practically possible. If the man continues while saying something in attempt to confirm with the woman if she really wants to stop or if he tries to confirm if there is an issue, with her for example the position they are in. I think we have all experienced sex where the woman or even we asked to stop because someone were physically uncomfortable but then the sex continued after getting into a better position. Does that mean the man becomes a rapist because he spent the seconds from her saying stop to actually stopping in order to make sure that is really what she wants.


I am not trying to justify not stopping as quick as possible, I am saying that as quick is possible may be 1 second in one case and 10 seconds in another.

Pond31

[HurtandConfused1]

Sorry if I offended you?

I wish you all the best in your case, good luck!

[Pond31]

Sorry if I offended you?

I wish you all the best in your case, good luck!

Hi HurtandConfused

You did not offend me. You had a point you made it and I replied that is the idea behind the forum.

Pond31

[Peter1975]

The law (in E&W at least) states that you must have a reasonable belief in consent or it is rape. If your partner says stop, you can no longer claim to have a reasonable belief.

Why on earth would you not stop immediately?

That's is what a prosecutor will ask.

[Pond31]

The law (in E&W at least) states that you must have a reasonable belief in consent or it is rape. If your partner says stop, you can no longer claim to have a reasonable belief.

Why on earth would you not stop immediately?

That's is what a prosecutor will ask.

Hi Peter1975

Why on earth would you not stop immediately?

I agree once a person says stop you should stop immediately practicable but the reason i am asking the question is how immediate is immediate. Do you have to jump off the person instantly when you hear the word "stop". If the person asked to stop attempts to confirm "reasonable belief" by asking "Are you sure?" or "Is something wrong?" then do they become rapists because they continued while asking the question or are all parties allowed time to clarify the situation. So I am asking does clarifying the situation with someone before you finally stop make you guilty of rape.

I can say from personal experience I have been asked to stop and been the stopper myself because someone was physically or emotionally uncomfortable for some reason when this was clarified the sex was willingly continued or ended. I have personal stop sex in number of occasions because of getting cramp in my leg, when I said stop my partner in each occasion asked "Why" before we fully did. So are they rapists for continuously pull me towards them and not instantly stopping?

Someone who continues with sex without stopping is off course a rapist.

Pond31

[Peter1975]

it's the "10 seconds" comment that bothered me.. time can be a rather subjective experience. 10 seconds kissing a girl or boy you like can feel all too brief but try holding your hand on a hot stove for the same amount of time..

I would say that once your partner has said for you to stop then 10 seconds is way too long, it may not be viewed as rape ( certainly not by me ) but certainly discourteous and selfish.

I would imagine though, should such a case come to court, the complainant and defendant would have quite different accounts of the timescale.

[Pond31]

it's the "10 seconds" comment that bothered me.. time can be a rather subjective experience. 10 seconds kissing a girl or boy you like can feel all too brief but try holding your hand on a hot stove for the same amount of time..

I would say that once your partner has said for you to stop then 10 seconds is way too long, it may not be viewed as rape ( certainly not by me ) but certainly discourteous and selfish.

I would imagine though, should such a case come to court, the complainant and defendant would have quite different accounts of the timescale.

Hi Peter1975

the complainant and defendant would have quite different accounts of the timescale.

That is the problem, one party could think it was 1 second and the other 10. I believe there was a man in Australia that was found guilty of rape for continuing for seconds but I don't know the exact amount.

I intended this thread to be a intellectual debate rather than a legal one.

Pond31

[Peter1975]

I'm neither qualified or knowledgable enough to have a legal debate Pond, and certainly not clever enough to be intellectual, but the law does have to draw the line somewhere.

I appreciate that, lost in the moment, "stop" may not register for a couple of seconds.. and may need repeating... and I would say that we are not talking about rape in the classic sense of the word but there is obviously a point where being a selfish lover carries over into assault and this would be where your partner feels aggrieved enough to report it.

Just to clarify, as it's not clear from my post above, it would be the different perception of time that would lead to differing accounts, no doubt exaggerated on both sides.